The Recovered Life Show

Introduction (00:00):

Lane Kennedy (00:00):
rumination that's happening. That cycle is changing the chemicals in your brain, right? It's depressing. You, it's making you anxious and those behave like it, then triggers a response. And that response is to do something harmful, right? And that's usually picking up a drink for relaxing. And so that's where mindfulness kind of comes into play. Damon is that when we approach it mindfully, we learn this tool to live in the present moment and not have that rumination cycle up here. And that changes everything.
Opening (00:40):
You're listening to the recovered life show. The show that helps people in recovery live their best recovered lives. And here is your host Damon, Frank,
Damon Frank (00:52):
Welcome back to the recovered life show. I am joined today by lane Kennedy lane is a yoga and meditation teacher. She focuses on helping people in recovery. She's also the host of the recover, like a mother podcast and sober for 25 years. Welcome to the show lane.
Lane Kennedy (01:11):
It's good to be here, Damon. Thanks for having me.
Damon Frank (01:13):
Thanks so much for coming on. I have so many questions for you because the whole topic of recovery and meditation, very big, very big. Now, last couple of years, I hear about this constantly. You know, if you're involved in 12 step group, they talk about meditation a little bit, but they don't really dive into it that much. So I'd love to hear your story. You've been sober for 25 years and you also are an expert at meditation and yoga. And you know, the big question I have is, you know, how did you get into this? How did you discover this? And also, you know, how can this really help your sobriety? How can meditation really
Lane Kennedy (01:53):
Help you? Yeah, that's a great place to start. So what I've know about sobriety is that there are a lot of ups and downs, peaks and valleys, ebbs and flow. Uh, we go through a lot in our lives and we don't drink. I don't drink through that. And I had my son later in life and I wasn't ready for that. And postpartum hit me like a ton of bricks fell on me and I thought, I thought I may lose my recovery. At that point. I was, uh, 15, no 16 year sober 14. Yeah. You know, in a good amount of sobriety under my belt. And what ended up happening is that, uh, I was prescribed an antidepressant and I didn't want to do that. And so that kicked off this journey into really diving into a meditation practice. And, you know, I didn't have any answers.
Lane Kennedy (02:56):
I just know that I wanted to feel better and I started feeling better. And I went down the neuroscience path and I became a graduate of the neuroscience academy. And I really started to investigate the brain and what's happening in the brain for somebody like me, an alcoholic, and how can I change the chemistry of it without picking up a drink or chocolate bar or something else. Uh, and so I went down this path and I discovered many types of meditation and I could just kept trying them. And there was no, uh, there was no stopping me because as an alcoholic, I need more all the time. I want to, I just like want to get in there. And about five years ago I found the practice of yoga nidra and it changed my recovery. It changed my path. It opened up a doorway to what I do now with people. Right. I really help people establish a mindful connection and mindful path, so they don't have to relapse again. Uh, it's a profound practice that allows, um, any kind of trauma to basically evaporate, which is amazing. And I'm not a doctor. Okay. So just pause right there. And I'm not saying like, this is fact, but this has been my experience. And then there's actually a lot of studies, uh, that worked with PTST uh that's that we can see that this type of practice actually.
Damon Frank (04:41):
Yeah. You know, there's a lot of discussion about trauma now. Um, when I first got sober, no one mentioned trauma. Um, it wasn't something that people talked about. I don't, I don't ever, if they did, I don't remember it. Um, but, but you, you mentioned something that's very interesting and it's been my experience as well, that right before 20 years, um, really things hit the fan. Right. I know that happened with me and in, in, in, in a very, in a very crucial kind of way, like it it's, it feels very, very real. Right. And when you just spoke about your experience, I can definitely relate to that. And right around that time, you're willing to do things that you weren't willing to do in early sobriety. I know that sounds for people who are listening to this that maybe have, you know, 30 days or a year or two years, they're like, I don't understand that.
Damon Frank (05:33):
You know, because I would tell friends in recovery, it's like, man, I'm willing to do things. I was not willing to do my first year. Right. And I was, I was willing to do almost anything my first year to stay sober. Um, and meditation always comes up right around that time. I know it came up for me and it's something that I kind of dove into a little bit, not really successfully, honestly, but I, I, I tried it. Um, do you find that people in, later in their sobriety quote, old timers, you know, are, are, are getting into meditation, not just people that are coming into the program now.
Lane Kennedy (06:06):
Yes. And yes. I feel like there is that dip where people are desperate and they want a change in their life. They realize that, you know, they stopped drinking, but they're kind of miserable still. And w why is that? Because they're quote on quote, doing everything, but they're not, you know, we are suffering from a mental illness and that mental illness needs a constant, uh, help. It needs a solution every day and it takes effort and discipline. And so people will, you know, dabble with meditation, but until they establish a regular practice, they're not going to see the results, which is really, um, it's kind of sad because they'll do it for a couple days and then they'll be like, oh, it's great. And then they'll forget to do it. And then they forget, and then they've lost their practice. And they're back at miserable. You
Damon Frank (07:03):
Know, it seems to me that when you talk about meditation, when you talk about recovery, when I think about it, or I talk with friends who are very into meditation, they, they always kind of start their story with being physically sober, but being emotionally Iraq, or even if they do feel that they have kind of a good emotional sobriety there, they still have what they refer to as an alcoholic thinking problem. Their thinking is all over the place. They don't, you know, making bad decisions, being impulsive, still not being able to have a quality of life, uh, where they can just sit and be for five minutes without their mind racing. Did you find that with you that that was your issue too, because, you know, I found that, you know, I've tried meditation, just like you said, I'm one of those people that have tried it and then done it for a period of time. And I saw a massive, um, a refocusing of my ability to stay attentive to what I really wanted to achieve in my life.
Lane Kennedy (08:08):
Uh, so the human brain forgets, we have, uh, this long history of forgetting things. And so the practice becomes about remembering to remember to practice because when we remember to practice the chemicals, the chemistry changes our brain. And then we have that ability to focus. We have the ability to stay present to be a great parent friend, right. We, but when we're not disciplined enough to do the practice, we fall down and is, this is very, very common because we're humans. This is the human experience, not about sober. It's not about, uh, not sober, although in recovery, we need to have this muscle flexed. Does that make sense more so than the average bear?
Damon Frank (09:02):
Absolutely. You know, the, the, um, and this is really hard to, I think, explain in words sometimes, but the, but I'll, I'll take a shot at it. The, the inability to detach from our own thinking. Correct. Um, which, which is a common issue with people that aren't in recovery, right? Like this, this is not just for people who are in recovery. I mean, there are a lot of people that do meditation that are not in recovery. Um, I would say most people do meditation or not in recovery. Right. It's not all about us, especially now, but I do find that the thing is, is that with people who are in recovery, the inability for, for us to be able to detach from obsessive thinking is incredibly dangerous as it goes on longterm, because that thinking creates actions and responses to those actions that we're really kind of unaware of, at least I, I was unaware of. And until I started to kind of unwind that, right. Um, then did I find that, wow, that is actually having a massive impact on my emotional sobriety as well, correct.
Lane Kennedy (10:11):
That rumination that's happening. That cycle is changing the chemicals in your brain, right? It's depressing. You, it's making you anxious and those behave like it, then triggers a response. And that response is to do something harmful, right. And that's usually picking up a drink or relapsing. And so that's where mindfulness kind of comes into play. Damon is that when we approach it mindfully, we learn this tool to live in the present moment and not have that rumination cycle appear. And that changes everything. And again, this is not, this is not anything that people are talking about, which is mind blowing to me because it's such a profound tool. And when you pair mindfulness and meditation together, you can maintain recovery and live in long-term recovery happily.
Damon Frank (11:04):
No, I think, yeah. And I think you're right. People aren't talking about, it's shocking what people aren't talking about that they've found. Right. I always find that like, you know, and if you're in recovery, no matter how long you have been in recovery, you know, I think the basics are great. Like how do I stay sober today? Right? Th th those are the building blocks, but one of the reasons why he did recovered life is that it's not really just about being sober, physically sober. And it's not being able to necessarily being about being able to pay your taxes and have a job and be able to raise kids. It's really about how, you know, we didn't get sober to live a crappy life. We got sober to live the best life possible. And you know, that's why I did recovered life is because I wanted to, you know, I wanted to explore different ways that people could live their best recovered life.
Damon Frank (11:50):
Right. And meditation really seems to be key to open the door to, uh, a better way of thinking, a better way of processing the thoughts that are coming in, because I know one thing that's for sure, with people that are in addiction, the ability to believe what they're thinking is, is very, very real, right? Like we can, we can really go down the rabbit hole with what we are. Think it's almost in a way, like if you look at now with the, with the exploration of personality disorders where some personality disorders will believe certain things that are happening with social cues that are not happening, right. It's almost the same with alcoholism and drug addiction, any kind of addiction. Really. We're really able to believe a story in which we narrate about ourselves. That potentially not that everybody doesn't do that, but potentially it's potentially very dangerous for us to be able to do that. Cause we'll go down that rabbit hole,
Lane Kennedy (12:49):
It's extremely dangerous. And that is why I love mindfulness because that thinking gets stopped in its tracks, or you have the ability to stop that process. And, and that's what I, that's why I love what I do. That's why I love my job that I have. That's my love sharing this. And teaching is that when you have that shift in your perception of I'm going to live in the present moment and I'm actually going to watch my thinking, it changes the way the brain thinks it changes it. When you get curious about your thinking, you're suddenly like, what, what, why am I thinking that it stops the process? And it is so easy. It's incredible.
Damon Frank (13:37):
Yeah. So let's dive into this and let's really give people here some case, cause I know you're an expert and I, you know, and I found out about you because people that have been on the show, I've told me about you and the success that they've had, you know, working with you, um, for people that are listening to this and saying, yeah, and you know, they might be sober. You know, some of the people that I know that are doing meditation now that are just exploring it, they've been sober 25, 30, 35 years. Right. Um, other people they've been sober 30 days and they're, and they're doing it, um, to, to one form or the other, but what really is mindfulness, right? Is it, is it just a heightened self-awareness because I think the words in the language are scary. Right? They're scary because it's like, especially if you're sober, it's like, I don't look. I, if, if I've been sober 28 years and it's working and I look around and things, aren't on fire and you know, the kids are fairly, you know, they're fed and they're happy and know ed, you know, everything's okay. Do I really want to tinker with my thinking? Right. Yeah. I'm unhappy sometimes. But how do I, you know, it's scary. So what is, what is mindfulness really from a layman's perspective? What does that mean to really
Lane Kennedy (14:48):
Put it simply it's observing your thoughts without judgment. Like, that's it like, you just watch your thoughts, come and go, come and go and then let them go. And you don't make any actions from them. Right? You have the ability to stop pause before reacting. Uh, it's tricky because with people who are sober, you know, there's, this self knowledge is avails us nothing, right? There's a quote. Uh, and there's a fine line of that self knowledge and the self-awareness of watching your thoughts and letting them go and not being reactive to them. So I really, when I work with a client, I share with them that during this process of becoming more mindful, you're also tapping into this universal presence, this element that got you sober or keeps you sober. And this is where mine's kind of blow off. They're like, what, what are you talking about? But this is where things start to change and shift is that when you are in that pause and you connect to your inner resource, there's no craving the crazy kind of dissipates. And you can have a beautiful moment without being reactive. And if I can stop people from being reactive, I'm winning, right? Like that's because it's that reactive impulse that causes problems. So when, when, when we're living mindfully, we have that ability to break that action. And
Damon Frank (16:36):
This, you know, this has been my personal experience in recovery. I was shocked. Um, when I started to get into this about, you know, I'm a marketer by trade. That's what I do, I market and sell things. So for, for me, um, it's all about framing. You know, when I work with the client, like how are we going to present this? And I was shocked as I started to work with a friend of mine who was like, nah, man, you're somebody who needs to just sit down and start with just being quiet for 20 minutes. Right. And literally, that's all I could do. I got about 10 minutes. I knew at 15 minutes into it a long time, actually a long time. Right? Like 10 minutes. Yeah. I I'm I'm exaggerating. It was probably more like five, right? Like I honestly, I just, I, it was a struggle because my, and I found it was interesting how much time and how much I was spending framing things. This is good. This is bad. Be careful of this. Take advantage of that constantly this committee and, and I, and, and my friend pointed out, wow, that's the exact same committee, 28. So years ago, that was saying, no, you can drink. Normally. It's totally fine. There's nothing wrong with you. You know? And I was like, oh, it is the same committee. And I had no idea they were wearing different clothes. They sounded differently, but it is the same committee.
Lane Kennedy (17:56):
So it's learning how to just suspend that. Just let that committee sit over there by itself. And then it disappears into the background. So your practice Damon is showing up, sitting for 10 minutes, looking at a tree for 10 minutes, going on a walk for 10 minutes. Right. And just letting those thoughts be there disguise as they are. Right. And just let them be. And then suddenly what will happen is that they will fade quietly into the background and everybody is like, wow, it works. But again, you have to do it. Otherwise those thoughts are there constantly. That's where humans, they're always going to be there. Our job is to learn how to navigate through them.
Damon Frank (18:52):
Well, I think it's, it's, you know, I've, I've heard people say lane that they're afraid to do that because without those thoughts, who are they going to be? Will they just be empty? Right. Like, man, it's almost similar to like, well, if I don't drink anymore, who will I be? I'm knowing that that's my whole identity, right. Is, is, is drinking or using drugs. So people that have a fear of that, what would you say,
Lane Kennedy (19:18):
Listen to the outcome. So I'm going to use you as the example, right? You take that mindful walk and you have those ruminating thoughts dressed up beautifully, and then suddenly they dissipate. And this brilliant idea comes to the forefront that you've been looking for. That you've been trying to figure out because those ruminating thoughts constantly go, go, go, go, go. But all of that over thinking, can't allow that beautiful thought to come up and appear, right. That prefrontal cortex gets so busy trying to figure stuff out that there's no inspiration. So when we allow the mindfulness to erase those thoughts, that really crystallized aha moment can happen. Does that make sense?
Damon Frank (20:10):
Okay. Absolutely. And I, and I, I always say this to people who are new, that are coming in that want to get sober and they're like, I just don't know. I'm not sure. And I always say that the ROI, the return on investment for the amount of time that you're going to spend to get sober and to do the work is going to have a massive return on, on your life. And in, you know, in the cases of addiction, you'll actually have a life to have a return on, which is always good. But I, you know, I found with the, with, with meditation, that that is the case. It's like, uh, it's almost like I have to get over myself. Yes. In order to have the big thought. Yes, that's it. And I keep thinking, you know, I got to figure that, you know, I'm one of these people that I have to figure this out. Now I have got to figure this out. And what I realized is I don't really have to figure out much
Lane Kennedy (21:02):
Now when we let go, that is when things happen, right. That's when this beautiful, uh, person appears or we get something in the mail. Uh it's. It allows when the brain is at rest, things happen.
Damon Frank (21:18):
Let's talk about the benefits of this, of tapping into this source that you're talking about, because that has been my experience in just doing spiritual work in general. And recovery was the, was the key in, I always viewed recovery was the catalyst, the gateway, yeah. To get into a bigger spiritual life. Right. It was almost just the gate I had to walk through in order to be able to access that. And I, and I believe that staying sober allows me the opportunity to keep accessing that and to keep growing in that way to use would be to give that up, it'd be gone. Right. Because you can't, you know, and so if anybody anybody's listening to this and saying, well, I'm going to meditate. And then I'm going to try to get, you know, that's going to get me sober wherever it's like, you almost have to make that decision. Right. Like I am going to kind of pursue this, but when you're pursuing it and tapping in, what are some of the benefits of that? Being able to tap beyond your thinking into this bigger source, what starts to happen in your life? What do you see with your clients and in your own experience that starts to
Lane Kennedy (22:24):
Inspiration. I mean, a lot of people are not inspired by life right now. Um, we're living in a really hard time. Let's face it. And so when we step into meditation and being more mindful, there is a huge amount of inspiration that appears. So creativity comes back online. Uh, the ability to have really, uh, important, honest conversations with people, uh, new ideas appear. But I think the biggest gift that shows up is this sense of calm. And then when you're calm, right, your cortisol levels come down again. I just talk about the chemistry, everything changes and shifts. You're able to sleep more deeply. Uh, your REM cycles go up, your deep risk goes up, right? Your body begins to restore at that cellular level longevity, let you know, for those of us that are in long-term recovery, the aging process is set in. So how do we, uh, roll that clock back?
Lane Kennedy (23:37):
We meditate, change the brain, the gray matter in the brain. So we can actually, um, put a defense against, uh, the brain diseases of Alzheimer's right. And dementia. I mean, these are not little things that happen, right? This is scientifically proven. We have studies about what the huge benefits of instilling, you know, a 20 minute practice every day. And just think when you do it for an hour, like I meditate an hour or 15 every day in the morning, sometimes twice, because I know that I want to be on the planet. I'm an 11 year old son. I want to make sure that I'm still around for him. And I don't want, uh, my brain to melt and get soft. And that's, what's, that's what's happening.
Damon Frank (24:22):
Yeah. The awareness to what's going on. I think with COVID, you know, we were just talking before we did this, that you're in, you're in the bay area and I'm in Southern California. You know, the, the whole lockdown thing has been horrible. And, and I even found myself and I, and I do, uh, you know, I feel like my program is good. I do, I I'm active, you know, I'm doing things, but I even found myself last night with the thought of like, this is never going to end. I'm never going to leave the house. Uh it's over my life is over, right. These are irrational thoughts and I'm not the only one having it. Like there's people, you know, I call people that I, or my gurus in recovery. And they're like, and one of them said, it's just like, I just can't handle this anymore. You know? And it's really, people's mental health is really being ground to dust right now. And you know, I'm sure people that are listening to this and said, well, this all sounds really good. But seeing for 15 minutes quietly is not going to change my life. Um, but I found that that is actually not true. That actually seemed 15 minutes. Quietly actually does have a massive shift in my life.
Lane Kennedy (25:33):
15 minutes a day is a great place to start. 10 minutes a day is a great place to start again. It's remembering to practice one minute, a day starts to change the brain, right? We need to change the chemicals in the brain. And when we do that, we're calm. We're not reactive. So any practice that you put into place is going to have benefit. And it's about making the time. There's a lot of like, oh, I have too much to do. I can't do that. You know, but it's really, if you project out on your life and what you want in your life, do you want to be happy? You got sober. So let's like, have a happy free life. Let's not be in misery. Let's not live in overwhelm. So if I want to do that, then 15 minutes a day, it's like changing the mindset. Like, oh, I'm going to brush my teeth every day. Cause I don't want cavities and all my teeth to fall out. It's that same thing I, I want, I don't want to get diabetes. So I'm going to take care of my body and put like green vegetables in my body instead of carbohydrates. Right. It's having that awareness. And especially for those of us in recovery, like, oh, this is going to be a part of my sober life. This is going to be part of my sober practice.
Damon Frank (26:50):
Yeah, sure. This, the whole idea of choices and the awareness that we have about ourselves, the ability to be honest with ourselves, you know, and I think you as a coach and maybe you can tap into this, the benefits of having a coach like you or a teacher like you, that can walk you through and maybe give you a little bit of accountability because sometimes I, I have some clarity of honesty. It's just like, wow, I need to do that. That's great. Yeah. That's going to have a major ROI on my life, major impact in my life, but I'm not going to do it.
Lane Kennedy (27:24):
So I'll give you a snapshot. Uh, when I coach with somebody, I do, you know, eight week programs with them and they have access to me and I send them mindful moments. And those mindful moments create that, oh yeah, that's what I have to do because people get so busy in their lives. Right. They just know, I can't, I don't have time. So when they get interrupted with me saying, Hey, it's time to, you know, sit down. They're like, oh yeah. That's, that's my time. You know, we have a lot of apps, you know, the mindfulness meditation app industry went up like 350% craziness, but the apps are not going to do anything unless you use them. Right. So I like, I have a coach, I have a teacher because there is that accountability factor. There's that measure of success. Like I know that when I started, I was this way and now so many weeks in I'm this way. Right. I have a practice that I can count on.
Damon Frank (28:23):
Yeah. And you know, and I think going, what we call old school is, you know, my, my, my mom told me this the other day, she says, wow, people really have value now for 10 people sitting down in a coffee shop talking, yes. Which two years ago, three years ago would have been like, there's no value in that. Right. But now it's like, wow, that connection, you know, I find that all these apps and everything it's degrading my life, I need to get rid of those. And I did do a practice where I just went through all my subscription services and everything and said, what you know is, is this serving me? Is this really making me happy? Is this getting what I want out of my life? What do I want, do I want, this is this where, where I want to be. So this is where I want to spend my time.
Damon Frank (29:05):
And I love the idea of, you know, w when you're talking to her about the coaching of just that little tap, sometimes of saying, Hey, wake up, you know, life is going on. And it's not the life that you think is going on. Something's something, something greater is, is actually happening in the background. How do you, what, what have you seen with people with their lives that you've coached, you know, totally changed their lives. Can you give a couple examples of, so, you know, people that are listening to say, you know, what am I really going to get out of meditation? How's this really going to practically help me
Lane Kennedy (29:38):
Financial success? Like all of my clients reach a new financial marker. And I don't, I can't stand that. It's about the money, but it's about the money, which is odd, like crazy. Uh, I have several clients that reached new figures, like can put it that way as a result of practicing and working with me, uh, evaluating, you know, what was important to them and then making shifts in their life for that outcome to appear. And they would, it would not have appeared without the work that we did together. And another really great one is health. Um, my clients will come to me with broken health and immune disorders. After eight weeks, we're feeling better. There's still some immune disorders happening, but they're feeling better and able to, uh, move forward without that depressing. Woe is me. My life is over, uh, relationships. So I'll have, uh, women in particular come to me, uh, you know, on the brink of divorce. And I want to leave my husband and things are not going well. And once we establish that practice, their life becomes fulfilling because it's not about that. Oh my God, I need that him, her to fulfill me, like, it's not about that. It becomes about this union with this universal element that keeps them, um, present, keeps them happy. They tap into that source. And that's the magic of, you know, the different practices that I share with them
Damon Frank (31:32):
Lane. This is really amazing. If they want to find out more about you and about your practice, how do they do that?
Lane Kennedy (31:41):
Excuse me. They can find everything over@lanekennedydotcomorrecoverlikeamother.com
Damon Frank (31:48):
Final, final thoughts here. If people are on the fence and they're thinking maybe I'll, maybe I'll try. Maybe I'll try this. Maybe I won't. What would be your, what would be your final thoughts about the impact that meditation can have?
Lane Kennedy (32:04):
Why would you not, why would you not want to improve the quality of your life? That's like, it doesn't make sense to me. Why would you not want to increase your health? Increase your relationship, happiness. Uh, find more joy, sleep better at night, have better sex. Like why would you not want all that? If you don't, if you want to stay in the misery, stay and then find me
Damon Frank (32:33):
So a good recovery is a choice you're saying right. Make that choice. Explore meditation. Yeah. Um, we're going to put links about how to access lane and her great coaching here. We're also gonna put her on recovered life.us. So you can also see everything about her, uh, by going to the site. Lynn Kennedy, thank you so much for joining us today and give us an insight on meditation.
Lane Kennedy (32:57):
Of course, it's been a pleasure. Thanks, Damon.
Close (33:00):
Keep the conversation going. Join recovered life. A community of like-minded people who are looking to live their best recovered lives. Membership is free and you can apply@recoveredlife.us.